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RUSTY_WOODS Posts: 917
11/29/19 10:53 A

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That's nice Shoapie, but some people can't eat certain foods at all. Moderation doesn't work for everyone.

I eat keto, and I will say that it is a high fat diet. I don't eat high protein. I eat a lot of macadamia nuts, cheeses, berries, olives, oils, butter, mayo, so I can get over 75% fat.

I eat about 12 ozs of meat a day, and 6 eggs. The carbs I eat.. less than 20 g, is from some veggies, and the eggs, cheese, berries, and nuts. I would love to eat more of these, but if I eat 30 g of carbs. I will binge, and have a 5000 calorie meal.

My tests are excellent.. and I am down 118 lbs., so it seems to be healthy for me. I have friends who have both lost 100 lbs.. one on WW, the other on a vegetarian diet. Those work for them, and they are healthy. All of us were motivated by health issues.. heart problem/skin cancer for me, cancer for the vegetarian, and thyroid removal/cancer for the WW person.

All of our diets could be done in a harmful way. We chose to do them in as healthy a way as possible, due to our main goal being health, not weight loss.. but the weight loss is sweet emoticon ... We are all monitored by a team of doctors, for obvious reasons, and all have become a lot more healthy, because we started on terrible diets.. some horrible version of the SAD.

It matters what you eat as a whole.. fat by itself isn't harmful. Carbs are not harmful themselves, if you can eat them and maintain control of your eating.. but together, you might have a doughnut.. or you could have a stir fry with 4 ozs. of chicken, peppers, mushrooms and onions, cooked in oil, or butter. Big difference.

You can choose a plan, which determines how you eat, but inside each plan, you have choices at every meal. You can follow any plan, and eat healthy, or poorly.

Meat can be on a healthy diet, or a poor one.. so can plants, fruits, and grains. The overall plan matters, and we need to stop acting as if one plan is the best, based on the opinion that the food on that diet is superior. That varies by the user of the diet.

What is a much bigger issue, is eating things that aren't real food. If you switch from these foods, to any plan which has you eating real food, you should see and feel improvement..on the scale, and from your tests at the doctor.

There are many great diets to eat. Pick one, and actually follow how it was intended.. if you do that, even the SAD works.. we simply won't, or can't follow it. That doesn't mean the diet is unhealthy.. it simply means we aren't ON it.

It's why I wouldn't recommend Keto. Most people can't stay on it, so it won't work for them. Same with a vegan diet. However they all work for some people, and if followed correctly are healthy, and work.




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SHOAPIE's Photo SHOAPIE Posts: 30,671
11/11/19 3:20 P

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I still believe in “all things in moderation”.



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SHAYNE139 Posts: 259
11/11/19 10:22 A

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I think a plant based diet is a good idea but you can, if you want, eat meat too. Moderation and clean eating is my goal. Processed vegan food is not healthy for a person if eaten daily.

TRUEPEACENIK's Photo TRUEPEACENIK Posts: 1,157
11/10/19 8:58 P

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I watched GameChangers and The Magic Pill almost back to back (laid up for a day), and I’d say the pro Ketogenic diet film was more guilty of using non data.

Both were obviously exploring topics with a push toward their “side.”

But GameChangers had more data to back it up.
Make that any data.


I don’t care what people eat. They are grown ups.
Just keep it off my plate.


Edited by: TRUEPEACENIK at: 11/10/2019 (20:59)
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LUANN_IN_PA Posts: 30,519
11/8/19 9:05 A

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Yet another film touting their agenda, using dubious data....


"We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand."
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11/8/19 8:53 A

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I absolutely agree, Andomeda. All of their arguments are anecdotal...Showing what happens to three men's erections after one day of plant based eating is not a scientific experiment. Any number of other factors could have been at play and not accounted for.

It frustrates me because they could have very easily created a great documentary on how it is possible to be an elite athlete and vegan. Instead, they use scare tactics and cherry-picked data to support their biases and basically say animal products will kill us. Overall quality of diet has many, many other factors besides whether or not it includes animal foods.



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ANDROMEDA06 SparkPoints: (3,183)
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11/8/19 4:53 A

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It forgot to mention that the two main athetes featured, Arnold Schwarzenegger and Patrik Baboumian did not build the body they had on a plant based diet. It also forgot to mention that the producer has some vegan protein supplements to sell.
Their claims regarding erectile function and beet juice have zero scientific basis.
I wish Netflix got rid of these "documentaries" citing pseudoscientific half truths.

I think going vegan is great for the environment, and is great for the animals, but these shows are giving vegans a bad name.

Edited by: ANDROMEDA06 at: 11/8/2019 (04:57)

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LE_SIGH's Photo LE_SIGH Posts: 2,822
11/1/19 9:53 A

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I just watched this too. I'm curious about how going vegan would impact my performance. Just losing 18 lbs took 45 second off my mile time without a lot of additional training. The inflammation discussion also interested me as I struggle with chronic pain.

Right now my family eats 2-3 vegetarian or vegan dinners a week. Breakfasts are pretty consistently animal products though - we keep chickens and we're big egg eaters.

I find that planning vegan meals takes more thought and preparation. I grew up eating a meat protein (usually chicken), a vegetable and a starch. Over the last 5 years I've slowly phased out the "starch" idea and evolved into serving multiple vegetables with meals. We still eat potatoes and quinoa but it's less often and meals always have at least 2 veg options. The meat is still a central part of the meal and migrating away from that practice takes some doing. I often pick a meat, decide what to do with it, and then select complementary sides. I'm trying to flip that on its head a bit, but I still find myself planning around the protein... last night for instance I had a bunch of white beans that I had soaked and wanted to use up, so I sauteed some garlic and pureed the beans in - voila! Refried beans. Then I started thinking about adding salad, veggies, taco shells, etc. I do feel better - more full, less crabby/ cravy - when I eat enough protein, but I'm wondering if this way of thinking is just a holdover over my meat-centric upbringing...

MRSLIVINGWELL's Photo MRSLIVINGWELL Posts: 533
11/1/19 8:50 A

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I love your acronym: JERF Just eat real food!! Absolutely.

The message is good in the movie but it could be better to be: WHOLE foods plant based!

Mrslivingwell
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JUSTEATREALFOOD's Photo JUSTEATREALFOOD Posts: 3,026
10/31/19 7:29 A

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I watched the documentary with my husband and it was selling a plant based diet hard!

I bothers me that these types of shows depict omnivores as eating monster meat portions, 16oz steaks for a meal. You can eat meat and not eat gigantic portions and you can eat meat but also eat loads of vegetables! Shock!

I didn’t like that the documentary had no emphasis on eating colourful veggies and fruits. Newsflash, just because a food is vegan doesn’t automatically make it healthy!

My vegan husband hardly eats anything made from fresh foods (unless I’ve made it). I personally don’t believe that overly processed, packaged foods should be a major part of anyone’s diet. But hey that’s just my 2 cents.



JERF - Just Eat Real Food

I'm not a doctor or dietitian. I'm just a real whole foods nutrition nerd.

I eat mostly vegetables, fats, meats, some fruit and dark chocolate. Unprocessed and preservative free food. And it's changed my life!

5'4"
Maintaining since 2012
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Lowering my A1C and keeping my blood sugar levels steady eating LCHF.


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INTOTHENEW's Photo INTOTHENEW Posts: 693
10/28/19 10:09 P

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“Not only that, but the obstructed blood vessels that cause erectile dysfunction also cause strokes, and heart attacks and vascular dementia.

No thanks!

Mrslivingwell
Coleader McDougall Plan”

“Not only that, but the obstructed blood vessels that cause cause strokes, and heart attacks and vascular dementia.“

Any different?

There is no bad food, only bad cooks.
MRSLIVINGWELL's Photo MRSLIVINGWELL Posts: 533
10/28/19 11:24 A

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Not only that, but the obstructed blood vessels that cause erectile dysfunction also cause strokes, and heart attacks and vascular dementia.

No thanks!

Mrslivingwell
Coleader McDougall Plan

It's not about perfect, it's about effort. Jillian Michaels


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INTOTHENEW's Photo INTOTHENEW Posts: 693
10/27/19 9:18 P

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“I’m just at the erection part....that’ll sell the men!”

Thigh gap, just sayin’.

There is no bad food, only bad cooks.
TRUEPEACENIK's Photo TRUEPEACENIK Posts: 1,157
10/26/19 11:22 A

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The scene with the three NFL players and their blood after eating beer or chicken burritos versus the black bean and avocado burritos was very clarifying.
Spoiler alert, so was eating a single plant-based meal.

Now, hearing Arnold Schwarzenegger make a lot of sense is really new territory for me, and I paid attention while he was California’s governor and in the fallout afterward.

I’m just at the erection part....that’ll sell the men!

Wake up every day knowing you make the decision to begin your journey anew.

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TRUEPEACENIK's Photo TRUEPEACENIK Posts: 1,157
10/25/19 6:35 P

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Just added it to my watchlist.
And here I had almost decided to let Netflix go....

I read an opinion piece by F Perry Wilson, MD in MedScape about what they headlined as plant based burgers, but was actually about leghemoglobin, a hemoglobin like molecule from legumes. In August, the FDA cleared it as a red food coloring that makes the Impossible Burger possible.
The red “bloody” center that looks medium rare.
Thing is, the macronutrient profile of Impossible is almost exactly the same as 85 percent beef.
Including saturated fat.
As I often had to say in college when cohorts would ask how so and so was so fat as a vegetarian...” well, Twinkies are vegetarian.”



Edited by: TRUEPEACENIK at: 11/10/2019 (20:56)
Wake up every day knowing you make the decision to begin your journey anew.

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MRSLIVINGWELL's Photo MRSLIVINGWELL Posts: 533
10/25/19 9:21 A

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We just finished watching "The Game Changers" on Netflix. This documentary about plant-based eating, protein, and strength. Directed by James Cameron (Titanic), featuring Arnold Schwarzenegger, Olympian athletes, NFL athletes, ultra marathon runners, etc...

It is very eye-opening to see the results they had in their performance.

Really great documentary. I think they shied away from mentioning that not only meat but other saturated oils, even plant-based ones, can be harmful. And also, I think they should have mentioned that plant-based processed food are not beneficial . Better to eat meat than to eat the monster-processed vegan foods like impossible burger. I think also that they don't delineate between people who are 100% plant based and those that are mostly plant based. The more vegetables you eat, the better.

Mrs Livingwell
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It's not about perfect, it's about effort. Jillian Michaels


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